20th century
The "6 largest mass killings" section is rather bad. Its standards of what constitutes a mass killing are vague at best if Mao's famine is included, which nobody seriously thinks was deliberately caused, is included, why not the Bengal Famine which WAS deliberately caused, and is at least comparable in scale to the Armenian genocide. Sorry, but I can only assume it's because the Bengal Famine was caused by the "good" British Empire, not some Communist enemy.
I suggest scrapping the single list, not to mention the emphasis on numbers, and going to a few different lists. One for deliberate mass killing-for-killing's-sake, as in the Holocaust and Rwanda. Another for war crimes & alleged war crimes which cost many civillian lives, such as the US/British saturation bombings of Germany and Japan. Another for famine, illness, etc caused or alleged to be caused by governmental policies, but which stop short of deliberate mass killing. And there should be a note that by far the greatest shorteners of life in the world are persistant social and economic conditions like lack of clean water, which NGO's have estimated could be almost eliminated with pretty modest contributions from the rich nations.
Nextel ringtones Eleland/Eleland 19:31, 19 Oct 2004
Indeed this section sucks. A mass killing isn't the number of people who died under a certain regime. Its an act, "holocaust", "collectivization" and "Great Purge" consitute them. "40 million dead under Mao" does not.
- CJWilly
The 50 million figure is't just 'Hitler'. It's the entire WW2 including the fighing in Asia and the Holocaust. Abbey Diaz Mixcoatl/Mixcoatl 13:43, 20 Nov 2004
jeff dahmer? HAHAHAHAHahahha
might wanna put pol pot in there before you put dahmer in there.
Pol Pot killed an est. 1.6 million people. Not enough to be ranked in the top-10 Free ringtones Mixcoatl/Mixcoatl 13:43, 20 Nov 2004
-
I have removed "indeed probably the most remarkable century in human history", because it seems to be a-historical and subjective. Majo Mills User:Tsja/Tsja
I think I'll organize the "Significant Persons" section in a bit more useful way. It's been growing, and I don't dispute the significance of the people being listed, but the list is getting long enough that it's going to be hard to follow. Mosquito ringtone User:Blain/Blain
Good grief! What a US-centric page!
2002/06/28 Perique
I think this page will need some cleaning up. The independence of Saudi Arabia and Estonia can hardly be called very important to world history, as are the Korean war and the Spanish Civil war. The Vietnam war could be mentioned, but only from a US point of view (and a Vietnamese point of view...). Similarly there's a bunch of "important people" I wouldn't expect here, such as Jozef Pilsudski (who the ... is he?), all of the aerospace pioneers and military leaders. Many of those could be mentioned in the "significant developments" or should only be mentioned implicitly there. Many of the other features can also be combined in shorter and more informative sections. The Soviet Union, the Cold War, Russian Revolution, socialism, Lenin, Stalin, Trotski, could all be combined in one or maybe two bullets. Similarly, the League of Nations and the UN could be put under internationalisation (or so), flight and space flight could be combined, etc., etc.
I'll have a go at this sometime, unless there are objections. Sabrina Martins User:Jheijmans/Jheijmans 02:06 Jul 22, 2002 (PDT)
What's with this "Notorious figures" heading?
That sounds rather difficult to maintain as Nextel ringtones NPOV.
I just moved Freud out of it, since from a cultural point of view, he fits in better with the scientists (however questionable his attempts at science may have been) than with Rasputin and Goebbels.
But come to think of it, should ''they'' be given such a classification either?
I'm not fond of either of them (nor of Freud, when you get down to it), but surely Hitler is more notorious than Goebbels.
Yet Hitler is neutrally placed alongside Churchill under "World Leaders" (which, while I'm on the subject, should say "Political" instead of "World").
Goebbels can be placed there too (or deleted entirely, since we're not listing any other Nazis), and Rasputin will fit in with "Religious Figures".
Why do we single out certain individuals for especial censure?
— Abbey Diaz User:Toby Bartels/Toby 12:05 Jul 26, 2002 (PDT)
Well, IMHO, in a global and historical perspective, '''Goebbels''' is a
more significative figure in the field of propaganda and advertising
than in the political arena. In fact, he probably will deserve a
place in the enciclopaedias of the future centuries much more than
'who the ... is that ''Nimitz''?'.
Other than that, the article does not say a word on one of the most
important invention of the century, one that freed hours of manual
labor changed the life of milions: the '''washing machine'''.
2002/07/29 Perique
You have a point about categorising Goebbels. I mentioned the Free ringtones washing machine, but it looks like you're going to have to write an article about it.
— Majo Mills User:Toby Bartels/Toby 08:13 Jul 29, 2002 (PDT)
-
Surely Colin Powell should be removed from the list of military leaders, otherwise you should list every peace-time chairman of the US joint chief of staff.
Also with reference to the washing machine, surely the female contraceptive pill made more of a difference to the life and to the culture of the latter half of the20th century than any other single invention. Cingular Ringtones User:mintguy/Mintguy 6 Aug 2002.
Surely? Some would argue that the invention of synthetic ammonia had a bigger impact than the Pill. After all, the fertilizer it produced was the key component in the Green Revolution (along with improved cereals, irrigation, and mechanization), which in turn prevented much starvation and war. Nobel prize winner Borlaug wrote ''It is estimated that 40% of today's 6 billion people are alive, thanks to the Haber-Bosch process of synthesizing ammonia (Vaclav Smil, University Distinguished Professor, University of Manitoba)'' [http://www.nobel.se/peace/articles/borlaug/borlaug-lecture.pdf]. Personally, I think there was a tangled web of causes and effects from 20th century inventions, and it's impossible to separate out the effect of a single invention.
List 'em! — consistent argument User:Toby Bartels/Toby 00:05 Aug 7, 2002 (PDT)
I think that the recent edit of the description of the rockefeller grew World Wars is worse in every way.
Listing specific European powers is wrong, since more were involved in each case.
It's true that more of Asia than just the east was in WWII, but that was true for WWI as well; the addition of the east is the change.
We could change "Europe" to "Europe and nearby regions of Africa and Asia" for WWI, but otherwise I think that it should go back to how it was.
— front quite User:Toby Bartels/Toby 00:05 Aug 7, 2002 (PDT)
Couldn't this page be a little more condensed, maybe some of the actually not so important facts be removed? Like a summary of the 20th century because the century covers to much to be listed on one page. also dance User:BL/BL
I'm surprised that there isn't a single mention on this page about the Civil rights movement in America. Yes there's a mention that women got the vote, but black people were elevated from not-much-better-than-animals to normal citizens. slaughter was User:Darac/Darac
Longest running tv shows
This section is completely inacurate. It should either be removed, or the title changed to most popular tv shows or something like that, or the shows should be replaced with the genuinely longest running ones. way yeah Saulisagenius/Saul Taylor 12:54, 12 Feb 2004
1890s & 2000s?
Why are the 1890s and 2000s included? future rulings Hemanshu/Hemanshu 05:48, 17 Mar 2004
*Handy reference, I guess; notice the different colouring. namely that Robin Patterson/Robin Patterson 04:42, 3 Dec 2004
Duplication
Wow. physicist question WhisperToMe/WhisperToMe http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=20th_century&diff=3598148&oldid=3573348 almost the entire article and nobody noticed. cornered me User:Eequor/Eequor 23:03, 21 May 2004
20th '''c'''entury, 20th '''C'''entury, '''T'''wenieth Century, or '''t'''wentieth century? Which is it? traumatized by Carlj7/Carl 01:57, 28 May 2004
Historical summary of the century
Should this article contain a historical summary of the 20th century? Should it have its own article (emerging, though terribly slowly, into a possibly great article at that smear The 20th century in review)? Should this article link to that one? What should be the relation to as persistent History of the world, canalsatellite into History of Europe etc? I think it's extremely important to have this overview of the century, and so it's nice if we agree on the forms – and also if we make it easy to find, as cuisine they The 20th century in review seems quite unknown to most. abc problems Jao/Jao 05:54, 16 Jul 2004
Highest grossing films
shouldn't these be in adjusted-for-inflation dollars, which would render 'Gone with the Wind' #1 I believe
Yes, but this is too US-centric anyway and should not be there. emperador carlos Erauch/Erauch 19:15, 7 Sep 2004
Too negative
Not enough attention is given to the really positive developments. Material should be paraphrased from the paper "Slouching Towards Utopia: The Economic History of the Twentieth Century" by Brad Delong. E.g.
"What took a worker in 1890 an hour to produce takes an a worker in a leading economy today only seven minutes: by this measure we today have some eight times the material prosperity of our counterparts of a little more than a century ago. But such a calculation is a substantial underestimate of the boost to productivity and material prosperity of the past century. We today are better at making the goods of a century ago, but we also have the technological capability to make an enormously expanded range of goods and services: from videocassettes and antibiotics to airplane flights and plastic bottles.
annual cow Erauch/Erauch 19:15, 7 Sep 2004
From his intro:
...the twentieth centurys tyrannies were more brutal and more barbaric than in any previous century.
Seems pretty negative to me.
Why not shinchi hondori The End of History and the Last Man by he check Francis Fukuyama?
Brunnock/Brunnock 10:03, Feb 17, 2005
That quote is true, and the fact should be mentioned, but the article needs balance. DeLong has done more than Fukuyama to quantify the advances.
Erauch/Erauch 20:32, 17 Feb 2005
Significant scientists
Some of those most significant scientists of the 20th century are a little, err, less significant than others not listed. I am sympathetic to trying to include non-Western scientists but if Ali Javan is not significant enough to warrant more than a stub, is he really worth being put on a list that seems to be something like the top 14 scientists of the 20th century? Is Andrey Nikolaevich Kolmogorov important on the same level as Heisenberg, Einstein, and Fermi (or even Ivan Pavlov)? Should Ernest Rutherford be on there? What about James Watson or Francis Crick or Francis Galton or Marie Curie or Jonas Salk? I'm not saying all of these people should be on there, but I think some people could be dropped. I know that any list has to be arbitrary at some point, but if we're only going to include a dozen or so people they should all be world-shaking in what they accomplished. Fastfission/Fastfission 03:40, 27 Oct 2004
Which years?
I can see nothing in the Common Era article justifying the early statement here "(1900-1999 in the sense of the Common Era calendar)". Any offers, or can we delete that? Robin Patterson/Robin Patterson 04:42, 3 Dec 2004
Deletions on December 14th, 2004
I eliminated the "largest most biggest supreme-o mass killings" because it's obnoxious, it's covered in the article, it has the worst possible title for a section I can conceive of, and finally, it is not found in any of the other centuries before the 16th. If this is too be included, I think it should be across all the areas instead of specific to these later centuries. Also, I took out the movies. Again, unless you want to go back and list the most popular (did no one see the "Most critically acclaimed films" section as hopelessly POV and without any specific facts whatsoever?) plays, operas, minstrels, etc. then this has no place here. Maybe a list page somewhere, but not here. TheGrza/TheUser Talk:TheGrza/Grza 08:56, Dec 14, 2004
Modernism template
I've added a Template:Modernism / template feel free to add new articles to it. Stirling Newberry/Stirling Newberry 00:29, 3 Jan 2005
Some deletions and other edits
I've just been trying to make sense of the introductory paragraphs, which meant making some cuts. I don't think that they should be very controversial, except for this:
:“Historians sometimes treat the twentieth century as covering only the years 1914–1991/91, the period of time between the outbreak of World War I and the fall of the Soviet Union.”
Historians might be primarily interested in that period, but any historian who treated century as lasting only 77 years should be sacked. I've done some looking through the books I have to hand (tomorrow I'll ask my historian colleagues), and I could find no example of any historian actually using ''twentieth century'' to mean 1914–91. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 17:53, 7 Feb 2005
:Agreed. -SocratesJedi/SocratesJedi / User_talk:SocratesJedi/Talk 07:05, 8 Feb 2005
The 'Short Twentieth Century' of only 77 years is an attempt to periodize man's history on something less arbitrary then "making periods start and end with really really really round numbers".
CJWilly/CJWilly 14:39, 15 Feb 2005
John Todd (biologist)
John Todd was recently added under scientists. Since I worked heavily on that section I seem to think it would be not in the spirit of community involvement to just remove him, but I know I've never heard of him and if nobody else has either perhaps he ought to be removed? Will someone please take a look at this and make a decision? Thanks. -SocratesJedi/SocratesJedi / User_talk:SocratesJedi/Talk 00:56, 11 Feb 2005
Merger
Why not merge this with The 20th century in review, and move the lists to separate pages (list of world leaders in the 20th century, etc.)? - Fredrik/Fredrik / User talk:Fredrik/talk 16:17, 13 Feb 2005
capitalisation
I'm not sure why this change demanded discussion first — it seems a relatively minor edit, and one that brings the article in line with its title (as well as with pretty standard usage). I didn't make the original edit, but I'd support it. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 13:25, 15 Feb 2005
:Minor? Have you looked at 'What links here'? You would have to move all the 'xxth century' pages to 'xxth Century'; change all the relevant categories (like :Tag: 20th century) and all the articles that sit in those categories; search out any list articles that include xxth century in the title. That's enough to keep a few people going for a few weeks. Noisy/Noisy / User talk:Noisy/Talk 14:58, Feb 15, 2005
::Ah, I think that I was overhasty, careless, or both. Instead of looking at the page I looked at the history, and compared edits — and I did it the wrong way round, so that it looked as though the edit ''removed'' the capitals. Just wait a moment while I take this foot out of my mouth, and I'll apologise properkly. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 18:41, 15 Feb 2005
:That explains it. No problem. I wondered why your comment seemed to have internal inconsistencies. I actually kind of agree with the anon that the 'Century' should be capitalized, but I don't fancy the amount of work involved. Noisy/Noisy / User talk:Noisy/Talk 19:30, Feb 15, 2005
I suggest scrapping the single list, not to mention the emphasis on numbers, and going to a few different lists. One for deliberate mass killing-for-killing's-sake, as in the Holocaust and Rwanda. Another for war crimes & alleged war crimes which cost many civillian lives, such as the US/British saturation bombings of Germany and Japan. Another for famine, illness, etc caused or alleged to be caused by governmental policies, but which stop short of deliberate mass killing. And there should be a note that by far the greatest shorteners of life in the world are persistant social and economic conditions like lack of clean water, which NGO's have estimated could be almost eliminated with pretty modest contributions from the rich nations.
Nextel ringtones Eleland/Eleland 19:31, 19 Oct 2004
Indeed this section sucks. A mass killing isn't the number of people who died under a certain regime. Its an act, "holocaust", "collectivization" and "Great Purge" consitute them. "40 million dead under Mao" does not.
- CJWilly
The 50 million figure is't just 'Hitler'. It's the entire WW2 including the fighing in Asia and the Holocaust. Abbey Diaz Mixcoatl/Mixcoatl 13:43, 20 Nov 2004
jeff dahmer? HAHAHAHAHahahha
might wanna put pol pot in there before you put dahmer in there.
Pol Pot killed an est. 1.6 million people. Not enough to be ranked in the top-10 Free ringtones Mixcoatl/Mixcoatl 13:43, 20 Nov 2004
-
I have removed "indeed probably the most remarkable century in human history", because it seems to be a-historical and subjective. Majo Mills User:Tsja/Tsja
I think I'll organize the "Significant Persons" section in a bit more useful way. It's been growing, and I don't dispute the significance of the people being listed, but the list is getting long enough that it's going to be hard to follow. Mosquito ringtone User:Blain/Blain
Good grief! What a US-centric page!
2002/06/28 Perique
I think this page will need some cleaning up. The independence of Saudi Arabia and Estonia can hardly be called very important to world history, as are the Korean war and the Spanish Civil war. The Vietnam war could be mentioned, but only from a US point of view (and a Vietnamese point of view...). Similarly there's a bunch of "important people" I wouldn't expect here, such as Jozef Pilsudski (who the ... is he?), all of the aerospace pioneers and military leaders. Many of those could be mentioned in the "significant developments" or should only be mentioned implicitly there. Many of the other features can also be combined in shorter and more informative sections. The Soviet Union, the Cold War, Russian Revolution, socialism, Lenin, Stalin, Trotski, could all be combined in one or maybe two bullets. Similarly, the League of Nations and the UN could be put under internationalisation (or so), flight and space flight could be combined, etc., etc.
I'll have a go at this sometime, unless there are objections. Sabrina Martins User:Jheijmans/Jheijmans 02:06 Jul 22, 2002 (PDT)
What's with this "Notorious figures" heading?
That sounds rather difficult to maintain as Nextel ringtones NPOV.
I just moved Freud out of it, since from a cultural point of view, he fits in better with the scientists (however questionable his attempts at science may have been) than with Rasputin and Goebbels.
But come to think of it, should ''they'' be given such a classification either?
I'm not fond of either of them (nor of Freud, when you get down to it), but surely Hitler is more notorious than Goebbels.
Yet Hitler is neutrally placed alongside Churchill under "World Leaders" (which, while I'm on the subject, should say "Political" instead of "World").
Goebbels can be placed there too (or deleted entirely, since we're not listing any other Nazis), and Rasputin will fit in with "Religious Figures".
Why do we single out certain individuals for especial censure?
— Abbey Diaz User:Toby Bartels/Toby 12:05 Jul 26, 2002 (PDT)
Well, IMHO, in a global and historical perspective, '''Goebbels''' is a
more significative figure in the field of propaganda and advertising
than in the political arena. In fact, he probably will deserve a
place in the enciclopaedias of the future centuries much more than
'who the ... is that ''Nimitz''?'.
Other than that, the article does not say a word on one of the most
important invention of the century, one that freed hours of manual
labor changed the life of milions: the '''washing machine'''.
2002/07/29 Perique
You have a point about categorising Goebbels. I mentioned the Free ringtones washing machine, but it looks like you're going to have to write an article about it.
— Majo Mills User:Toby Bartels/Toby 08:13 Jul 29, 2002 (PDT)
-
Surely Colin Powell should be removed from the list of military leaders, otherwise you should list every peace-time chairman of the US joint chief of staff.
Also with reference to the washing machine, surely the female contraceptive pill made more of a difference to the life and to the culture of the latter half of the20th century than any other single invention. Cingular Ringtones User:mintguy/Mintguy 6 Aug 2002.
Surely? Some would argue that the invention of synthetic ammonia had a bigger impact than the Pill. After all, the fertilizer it produced was the key component in the Green Revolution (along with improved cereals, irrigation, and mechanization), which in turn prevented much starvation and war. Nobel prize winner Borlaug wrote ''It is estimated that 40% of today's 6 billion people are alive, thanks to the Haber-Bosch process of synthesizing ammonia (Vaclav Smil, University Distinguished Professor, University of Manitoba)'' [http://www.nobel.se/peace/articles/borlaug/borlaug-lecture.pdf]. Personally, I think there was a tangled web of causes and effects from 20th century inventions, and it's impossible to separate out the effect of a single invention.
List 'em! — consistent argument User:Toby Bartels/Toby 00:05 Aug 7, 2002 (PDT)
I think that the recent edit of the description of the rockefeller grew World Wars is worse in every way.
Listing specific European powers is wrong, since more were involved in each case.
It's true that more of Asia than just the east was in WWII, but that was true for WWI as well; the addition of the east is the change.
We could change "Europe" to "Europe and nearby regions of Africa and Asia" for WWI, but otherwise I think that it should go back to how it was.
— front quite User:Toby Bartels/Toby 00:05 Aug 7, 2002 (PDT)
Couldn't this page be a little more condensed, maybe some of the actually not so important facts be removed? Like a summary of the 20th century because the century covers to much to be listed on one page. also dance User:BL/BL
I'm surprised that there isn't a single mention on this page about the Civil rights movement in America. Yes there's a mention that women got the vote, but black people were elevated from not-much-better-than-animals to normal citizens. slaughter was User:Darac/Darac
Longest running tv shows
This section is completely inacurate. It should either be removed, or the title changed to most popular tv shows or something like that, or the shows should be replaced with the genuinely longest running ones. way yeah Saulisagenius/Saul Taylor 12:54, 12 Feb 2004
1890s & 2000s?
Why are the 1890s and 2000s included? future rulings Hemanshu/Hemanshu 05:48, 17 Mar 2004
*Handy reference, I guess; notice the different colouring. namely that Robin Patterson/Robin Patterson 04:42, 3 Dec 2004
Duplication
Wow. physicist question WhisperToMe/WhisperToMe http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=20th_century&diff=3598148&oldid=3573348 almost the entire article and nobody noticed. cornered me User:Eequor/Eequor 23:03, 21 May 2004
20th '''c'''entury, 20th '''C'''entury, '''T'''wenieth Century, or '''t'''wentieth century? Which is it? traumatized by Carlj7/Carl 01:57, 28 May 2004
Historical summary of the century
Should this article contain a historical summary of the 20th century? Should it have its own article (emerging, though terribly slowly, into a possibly great article at that smear The 20th century in review)? Should this article link to that one? What should be the relation to as persistent History of the world, canalsatellite into History of Europe etc? I think it's extremely important to have this overview of the century, and so it's nice if we agree on the forms – and also if we make it easy to find, as cuisine they The 20th century in review seems quite unknown to most. abc problems Jao/Jao 05:54, 16 Jul 2004
Highest grossing films
shouldn't these be in adjusted-for-inflation dollars, which would render 'Gone with the Wind' #1 I believe
Yes, but this is too US-centric anyway and should not be there. emperador carlos Erauch/Erauch 19:15, 7 Sep 2004
Too negative
Not enough attention is given to the really positive developments. Material should be paraphrased from the paper "Slouching Towards Utopia: The Economic History of the Twentieth Century" by Brad Delong. E.g.
"What took a worker in 1890 an hour to produce takes an a worker in a leading economy today only seven minutes: by this measure we today have some eight times the material prosperity of our counterparts of a little more than a century ago. But such a calculation is a substantial underestimate of the boost to productivity and material prosperity of the past century. We today are better at making the goods of a century ago, but we also have the technological capability to make an enormously expanded range of goods and services: from videocassettes and antibiotics to airplane flights and plastic bottles.
annual cow Erauch/Erauch 19:15, 7 Sep 2004
From his intro:
...the twentieth centurys tyrannies were more brutal and more barbaric than in any previous century.
Seems pretty negative to me.
Why not shinchi hondori The End of History and the Last Man by he check Francis Fukuyama?
Brunnock/Brunnock 10:03, Feb 17, 2005
That quote is true, and the fact should be mentioned, but the article needs balance. DeLong has done more than Fukuyama to quantify the advances.
Erauch/Erauch 20:32, 17 Feb 2005
Significant scientists
Some of those most significant scientists of the 20th century are a little, err, less significant than others not listed. I am sympathetic to trying to include non-Western scientists but if Ali Javan is not significant enough to warrant more than a stub, is he really worth being put on a list that seems to be something like the top 14 scientists of the 20th century? Is Andrey Nikolaevich Kolmogorov important on the same level as Heisenberg, Einstein, and Fermi (or even Ivan Pavlov)? Should Ernest Rutherford be on there? What about James Watson or Francis Crick or Francis Galton or Marie Curie or Jonas Salk? I'm not saying all of these people should be on there, but I think some people could be dropped. I know that any list has to be arbitrary at some point, but if we're only going to include a dozen or so people they should all be world-shaking in what they accomplished. Fastfission/Fastfission 03:40, 27 Oct 2004
Which years?
I can see nothing in the Common Era article justifying the early statement here "(1900-1999 in the sense of the Common Era calendar)". Any offers, or can we delete that? Robin Patterson/Robin Patterson 04:42, 3 Dec 2004
Deletions on December 14th, 2004
I eliminated the "largest most biggest supreme-o mass killings" because it's obnoxious, it's covered in the article, it has the worst possible title for a section I can conceive of, and finally, it is not found in any of the other centuries before the 16th. If this is too be included, I think it should be across all the areas instead of specific to these later centuries. Also, I took out the movies. Again, unless you want to go back and list the most popular (did no one see the "Most critically acclaimed films" section as hopelessly POV and without any specific facts whatsoever?) plays, operas, minstrels, etc. then this has no place here. Maybe a list page somewhere, but not here. TheGrza/TheUser Talk:TheGrza/Grza 08:56, Dec 14, 2004
Modernism template
I've added a Template:Modernism / template feel free to add new articles to it. Stirling Newberry/Stirling Newberry 00:29, 3 Jan 2005
Some deletions and other edits
I've just been trying to make sense of the introductory paragraphs, which meant making some cuts. I don't think that they should be very controversial, except for this:
:“Historians sometimes treat the twentieth century as covering only the years 1914–1991/91, the period of time between the outbreak of World War I and the fall of the Soviet Union.”
Historians might be primarily interested in that period, but any historian who treated century as lasting only 77 years should be sacked. I've done some looking through the books I have to hand (tomorrow I'll ask my historian colleagues), and I could find no example of any historian actually using ''twentieth century'' to mean 1914–91. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 17:53, 7 Feb 2005
:Agreed. -SocratesJedi/SocratesJedi / User_talk:SocratesJedi/Talk 07:05, 8 Feb 2005
The 'Short Twentieth Century' of only 77 years is an attempt to periodize man's history on something less arbitrary then "making periods start and end with really really really round numbers".
CJWilly/CJWilly 14:39, 15 Feb 2005
John Todd (biologist)
John Todd was recently added under scientists. Since I worked heavily on that section I seem to think it would be not in the spirit of community involvement to just remove him, but I know I've never heard of him and if nobody else has either perhaps he ought to be removed? Will someone please take a look at this and make a decision? Thanks. -SocratesJedi/SocratesJedi / User_talk:SocratesJedi/Talk 00:56, 11 Feb 2005
Merger
Why not merge this with The 20th century in review, and move the lists to separate pages (list of world leaders in the 20th century, etc.)? - Fredrik/Fredrik / User talk:Fredrik/talk 16:17, 13 Feb 2005
capitalisation
I'm not sure why this change demanded discussion first — it seems a relatively minor edit, and one that brings the article in line with its title (as well as with pretty standard usage). I didn't make the original edit, but I'd support it. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 13:25, 15 Feb 2005
:Minor? Have you looked at 'What links here'? You would have to move all the 'xxth century' pages to 'xxth Century'; change all the relevant categories (like :Tag: 20th century) and all the articles that sit in those categories; search out any list articles that include xxth century in the title. That's enough to keep a few people going for a few weeks. Noisy/Noisy / User talk:Noisy/Talk 14:58, Feb 15, 2005
::Ah, I think that I was overhasty, careless, or both. Instead of looking at the page I looked at the history, and compared edits — and I did it the wrong way round, so that it looked as though the edit ''removed'' the capitals. Just wait a moment while I take this foot out of my mouth, and I'll apologise properkly. Mel Etitis/Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 18:41, 15 Feb 2005
:That explains it. No problem. I wondered why your comment seemed to have internal inconsistencies. I actually kind of agree with the anon that the 'Century' should be capitalized, but I don't fancy the amount of work involved. Noisy/Noisy / User talk:Noisy/Talk 19:30, Feb 15, 2005
posted @ 4:35 PM
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